Give feedback on this site

If you have a comment or suggestion about the Singing the Faith Plus website, please leave it below.

155 Responses to Give feedback on this site

  1. Brian Edwards says:

    Our church in Malvern, Lansdowne Crescent, purchased the organ copies edition of the music version when they first came out. Now we find they are coming apart at the hinges, all three of them. A professional book binding has remarked that the hinges are completely inadequate for the weight of volume. We are having to get all three repaired with stronger and more correct hinges at a cost similar to their original cost. Has anyone else found problems with the organ copies? We find the normal music editions difficult to fit on our piano and organ music stands because of their thickness. Has anyone found an answer to this?

  2. Norman Lester says:

    Copyright enquiry
    Nine out of ten churches in Weston-super-Mare and Burnham on Sea (07/17) have purchased and use Singing the Faith. At a Circuit Service (in Victoria which has the usual comprehensive CCLI), organist and ‘augmented’ choir will use StF tune books, congregation having a printed order of service including hymns by Bernadette Farrell, Keith Getty and Stuart Townend, Richard Gillard, Fred Pratt Green and joy Dine.
    Does Circuit need to purchase licences or permissions for their Order of Service?

  3. Kier Graham says:

    Dear Sir/Madam,
    Please can you send me or tell me where I can get the lyrics for the Allan Dickinson hymn Where can we find you, Lord Jesus, our Master?
    Yours Sincerely – Kier Graham

  4. Ian Harrison says:

    Sad to say that being only an organist (I don’t pick ‘em, I only play ‘em) I hadn’t taken much notice of the StF newsletters that plonk into my inbox until today when I looked at Lawrence’s description of the StF+ website – and it’s very good indeed!
    But I was a bit bemused by the “Metrical index” – which lists hymns, but not necessarily tunes. The metre of a hymn is largely irrelevant to preachers and congregations – the key thing is what tune it can be set to. StF has a fair selection of tunes, but it is by no means exhaustive and omits many tunes that were previously “standards” in Methodist hymnody. For example, on Palm Sunday I always use “St Drostane” (MHB 192) for “Ride on, ride on in majesty” which was written for this hymn by Dr Dykes – but was dropped from H&P because the supposed collaborators (the URC) preferred “Winchester New” – nice tune, but a bit done to death.
    What is needed within the Metrical Index is a more comprehensive listing of tunes and where they may be found – or, preferably, a PDF download for those that are out of copyright, or where copyright can be negotiated.

    • Editor says:

      Thanks for being in touch, Ian. I’m glad you found the video helpful – and hope that what we offer can be useful to you as a “player”, and not just to the “pickers”! I think I get where you’re coming from as regards the Metrical Index. As you say, the different metres do link to the first lines of hymns and not directly to a list of tunes as in the back of the book. Mainly this is a limitation of the website structure, and there’s little we can do about that. That said, the tune for every hymn is always one of the links listed underneath the hymn title – though I appreciate that it takes a moment or two find the tune name. Also because of how the website is set up – but also because of the overall aims of StF+ – we’re not in a position to list tunes that are not in StF itself (unless they are new tunes that accompany hymns published on the website itself). I hope this helps a little – if I’ve missed the point of your comments, please do get back in touch.

  5. Derek McLean says:

    I find the singingthefaithplus website really useful for preparing regular lectionary based morning services. It is much less helpful for services where I’m using other passages such as the second service lectionary.
    Two enhancements would make a huge difference:
    1) The Scriptural Index could be uploaded so that rather than simply linking to a copy of the paper version it produces this in the same format as the week by week readings. (I. e. easily accessed and with titles)
    2) I’d like occasionally to look at services which aren’t for the current or adjacent month. This is theoretically possible because you can step month by month through the calendar. So, if I want to look at the third Sunday in Lent last year for example I can step back one month at a time to get there. However, having done so, the calendar then reverts to the current month so I end up repeating the process several times. Can you improve the ability to look up historic data?

    Any plans?

    • Editor says:

      Hi Derek – thank you for being in touch. We’ll look in to your question about the Scriptural Index. Regarding the ability to go to future months – yes, this is a slightly less than ideal quirk of the website structure! I know exactly what you mean. However, we don’t have a lot of control over this unfortunately. What I have found, which is of some benefit in the situation you describe, is that though the calendar reverts to the current month, if you use the “back” arrow on your browser – it takes you back to the calendar month that you have just searched. Does that makes sense?!

  6. Dottie North says:

    I want to say a big ‘Thank you’ for the Singing the Faith website. I always check it out before preparing a service – especially for the Lectionary readings and suggested hymns. I may not use them all, sometimes none, but they set me thinking as I pray about the message to deliver. The suggestions for ‘special’ services are especially helpful. I’m preaching on Mothering Sunday – the video you posted will be very helpful and so fits with how I was thinking. Although I think Singing the Faith is pretty good I have one question about the Hymn Book, and that is why so many tunes have been set to quite complicated settings when the originals were perfectly fine?

    • Editor says:

      Many thanks for your feedback, Dottie. I’m especially glad that the Mothering Sunday resources were of help to you. I will pass on your observation about tune settings, though obviously these are decisions that can’t now be altered. Thanks for your continuing interest in Singing the Faith Plus.

  7. Roger Neal says:

    I’m involved with a music group at my church. The church has all the appropriate licences for using StF including photocopying music. The music group find the music books of StF very cumbersome and are searching for an electronic copy so that we can print scores for our singers and musicians, so far to no avail. I hear that the CD version will produce a score associated with the midi files; is that true, and if so why is it not available to CCLI & Calumus licence holders without the need to purchase a huge pile of irrelevant CDs?
    One of our smarter members wrote a routine to download the whole of StF words, in exactly the way that an individual hymn would be downloaded, so that we don’t have to struggle with it each week. We have more than enough electronic licences so we’re not breaking any regulations, but it all seems far from ideal.
    We just don’t seem to have quite arrived in the modern world.

    • Editor says:

      Dear Roger – thanks for being in touch. We do understand your frustrations though are not in a position to alleviate them a great deal I’m afraid. Due to copyright restrictions (see Copyright Matters http://www.singingthefaithplus.org.uk/?page_id=5926, if you’ve not already done so), we have been unable to repoduce music outwith the printed music and organ editions. The only reassurance I can give is that I have checked with the producers of the CDs and midi files and, to their knowledge, there is no in-built facility to produce a printed score from the midi files. It is likely that there is software available to enable this (Sibelius, for example??); however, this is not something that has been made available by Hymns Ancient and Modern or by oursleves. To that extent, you’re not missing out by not purchasing the CD/midi file set.

      • Roger Neal says:

        Thanks for your reply but I don’t quite understand the copyright problem, as we have all the necessary licences for copying; it’s just very messy trying to photocopy or scan from a 3″ thick music book. I’ve always felt that the licensing companies and copyright holders want to restrict access to their assets, rather than maximise their value. It’s a bit like comparing Microsoft and Apple; Apple almost give their operating system away, whereas Microsoft try to sell you everything. Look where the success lies.
        There is a “Best of SoF” digital songbook available for instance, but that only has a total of 675 songs (from over 2500); it seems a shame that these limitations to progress remain and it obviously only encourages hacking.

        • Editor says:

          We do agree that the copyrighting process is complicated, Roger – sorry for any inconvenience that this causes.

  8. Wendy Dixon says:

    Hello I’m trying to purchase your ‘singing with faith’ music book, for my mum and she is after a paperback edition, her minister has shown hers to them and they all agreed it was a lot lighter, I’m not able to find a softback addition on the obvious sites can you guild me to where I could purchase it from please.
    Regards
    Wendy

    • Editor says:

      Sorry for the slow response. You can purchase all editions of Singing the Faith from Methodist Publishing. Information is on our All the Editions page, together with the links you need. It sounds like you’re looking for the presentation edition. I hope this helps.

  9. Janet Davies says:

    I purchased a copy of Singing the Faith on 21st September 2011. I have found 2 hymns that differ from later copies.

    156 – verse 3 words have been changed

    583 – later editions have words written on the repeat.

    As a Methodist Church organist they nearly caught me out ! I am surprised there have been updates in so short a time. Please advise.

    Blessings

    Janet Davies

  10. Tom Pardy says:

    So many of the tunes in StF do not have names. This is very frustrating when trying to find the tunes in an index or (in my case) compile an index of hymn tunes from several hymnals. Even more mystifying, some of these tunes HAVE names in H&P and in other hymns (like the Australian Together in Song). Why is this? And why so many?

    • Editor says:

      Hi Tom – thanks for your enquiry. I’m afraid I can’t give you a definitive answer on this one, though I do know that a number of the praise-band style hymns/songs tend not have a tune name but are known simply by the first line of the text.

  11. Kathleen Allen says:

    Hi
    Is it just me or are others finding it difficult to know when the musical introduction has finished and the singing should begin? Have chosen ’428 I’ve come to wash my self in the living water’ and need to use the CD. I’m told there is one bar of introduction. I’m not musically able but neither am I without some knowledge but I just can’t get it! Don’t know if this type of issue has been posted by others so apologies if it has but feeling a bit frustrated at the moment! Kathleen

    • Editor says:

      Really sorry this has left you feeling frustrated, Kathleen. I’m afraid we can’t help hugely from here and hope that perhaps there is a colleague or friend that you can check this out with and work out the appropriate solution. Sorry not to be of more help – but all good wishes with working this out.

  12. Felicity Al-Hassan says:

    I find choosing hymn from STF rather challenging, probably because I cannot read music or play a musical instrument. STF contains some very lovely worded hymns which would greatly enhance worship, however to find out whether the tune is familiar or one that is easy for the congregation to pick up, my main resource, given that the organist is not always accessible, is You Tube, where sadly, I often draw a blank so that I am left unable to incorporate the item, which is frustrating.
    Could you please advise what other means are available to facilitate hearing the tune for the hymns.

    Many thanks,

    • Editor says:

      Dear Felicity – I share your frustration about this. This has been a source of concern to us for some while, and we’ve found our hands tied by copyright restrictions. We’d very much like to have at least 30″ clips of the music online, so that you could get a feel of a tune at least. But I’m afraid that this has not been possible to date. However, nudged by your enquiry, I will re-visit the question and see whether there is any way in which we can move forward. Many thanks for being in touch.

  13. Margaret Barnes says:

    Is there an easy way to use the StF words and create Powerpoint slides – in other words can I do the whole lot at a time or do I have to do it hymn by hymn?

    Would save a lot of people a lot of time if Powerpoint version available.

    • Editor says:

      Hi Margaret – thanks for your enquiry. I’m afraid that the hymn by hymn approach is the only one. For copyright reasons, this is why the publishers produced the Electronic Words Edition as they did. Sorry!

  14. Don Macalister says:

    The availability of the tunes on cd is great but would it be possible to sell, at hopefully a much reduced cost, the single cd with midi files? As a not very musical minister I would value being able to quickly and easily hear the tune of a hymn (especially a hymn new to me) when choosing hymns for worship.

    • Editor says:

      Sadly not, Don. The copyright requirement was that the midi files (which are of course easily copyable and transferrable) could only be published alongside the full CD set. Sorry to disappoint.

  15. Valerie Ashcroft says:

    I downloaded an app for my old phone to access StF plus. Can you tell me how to download the app for my new phone please?

    • Editor says:

      Hi Valerie – the app you need in order to access StF+ is the Methodist Church app, which you can get via Play Store or Apple Mac’s App Store. From the Methodist App you access StF+ via the lectionary icon on the home page. From there you can move into the StF+ site. I hope this helps.

  16. Peter Ellis says:

    Hi, thankyou for the invaluable effort that goes into this site.
    I have just been planning for my service for 27-7-14.
    On the choice of hymns, I notice that you bible readings differ from the lectionary reading I have been given. they are Gen 29…ps105…Rom 8… and Matt 12.
    have I missed something?

  17. Peter Roberts says:

    Just to say thank you for all the work that goes into this website.
    Although I now only take services once a month at an independent chapel half way up Holme Moss (an old “Sunday School”) in West Yorkshire, I have used the RCL for a number of years to provide readings and a theme for my services. Until I found your website, I had often to struggle to work out what the readings were from my copies of the RCL (it’s always mystified me that we can’t as Christians even completely agree on a calendar or a common lectionary) and then choose hymns to fit my theme. Now, although I still as a mental exercise use the printed RCL, I check your website for confirmation and to get hymn suggestions, killing two birds with one handy stone.
    A brilliant service for all service leaders and preachers. Thank you.

    • Editor says:

      Thank you very much for being in touch, Peter. We have almost come to the end of our first three-year cycle, so it’s very encouraging to hear of where our work has been of value. We have some ideas of what we can add to this service over the course of the next cycle, so “watch this space”!

  18. Your highlighting of George Herbert in the May edition of the News inspired us into a whole 8 week series on Herbert for our Thursday lunchtime services. And we have also used the hymns in Hymns and Psalms and thus dug our copies of H & P – which I hope makes Annette, happy.

    • Editor says:

      Thanks, Jennifer – that’s good to hear. It was certainly a fascinating experience exploring the three poem-hymns in Singing the Faith, and “Come, my Way, my Truth, my Life” in Hymns & Psalms is a really distinctive text – quite unusual. It would be great to know more about how you have planned your series.

  19. Richard Penna says:

    A couple of comments on the StF electronic version:

    - I’ve come across a number of hymns which it won’t allow me to export, but for the purposes of a service, I’m simply preparing the hymns I’ve been asked to, and most lyrics can be found online. If they’re in the book, they should be projectable.

    - I’d like to see a ‘batch export’ function of some sort. The most efficient way to make a schedule is to type in a list of hymn numbers, and have associated text files dumped in a folder all at once. The current interface puzzles me – why do I need to see a fuzzy preview of the page?

    Single-machine registration may be a copyright requirement, but it doesn’t work well with multiple people preparing, and machines unexpectedly dying before a service. A per-Church license would be so much easier.

  20. John Elston says:

    I have downloaded the words for STF409 from our electronic version but a message appears that informs me that our CCL license will not cover the projection or printing of the words. It seems strange that I allowed to download something we cannot use.How many other hymns in STF are not covered by current CCL license?

    • Editor says:

      A slightly tricky one this. A number of hymns (including this as well as popular hymns hymns by Bernadette Farrell) are covered by Calamus. You can find links to discover which hymns are covered by whom on our Copyright page http://www.singingthefaithplus.org.uk/?page_id=5926. If you are likely to use these hymns regularly, you’d be as well to obtain a Calmus license in additon to your CCL license. If you think this is more of a one-off usage, we suggest you email the publisher (GIA) and ask for a one-off permission. Sorry that this copyright business can get so complicated! Thank you for asking.

  21. Clive Davis Stowmarket Methodist Church says:

    Re set of 33CDs
    I don’t know whether anyone has pointed out the error on the sleeve to disc 24.
    I loaded track 6 on CD
    24 expecting to have the accompaniment for Hymn 579. When the congregation failed to be able to sing along we realised that the tracks have all been shifted by one because the first track on the ( hymn 573)has track 31 against it! Consequently 579 is against track 6 but should be track 7.
    Has a label be reprinted with the correct tracks? if so can you send us one please.
    It causes problems for us CD operators who are not musical and would not know by ear if the correct track is playing.

  22. Jill Bridges says:

    Can you listen to hymns/psalms from Singing the Faith on the website. I am a Local Preacher on Trial and my music knowledge is poor.
    Thank you

    • Editor says:

      Hi Jill – sadly this is not something we’ve been able to do so far, because of copyright reasons. We re-visit this issue (which, we agree, is a major one) at regular inervals and will do so again. As soon as we can create a solution, we will. Sorry we cannot be of more (or immediatge) help.

  23. ANDREW TRUSSELL says:

    Do you know of anywhere near Wrexham where Taize is sung?
    thanks
    andrew

  24. Robin Watson says:

    Where can I buy the organ edition (3 volumes) of Singing the Faith?

  25. John Green says:

    To assist with choosing alternative tunes it would be very useful to have the metrical info. added to your index as a separate column so that the Excel file could be sorted on this metrical column. This would provide an instant display of alternatives with ‘first line’ info as identification. Thanks

    • Editor says:

      Hi John -

      Thanks for your comments.

      Have you used the Metrical Index included on the website (with link towards the bottom right hand side of any page of site): http://www.singingthefaithplus.org.uk/?page_id=3041 Here you can click on any metre and this will bring up all the hymns in that metre, listed by first line as you suggest. I wonder if this offers the facility that you’re hoping for.

  26. Emmanuel Aggrey-Ogoe says:

    I bought the electronic word edition and installed it a year ago. I reinstalled Microsoft word on my laptop last month and lost the electronic version. I still have the key so I downloaded and reinstalled it but have not been able either to re- register or have access to the electronic edition on my laptop. What should I do?
    Emmanuel

  27. stuart pedder says:

    Hi, I am slightly shocked that when searching for hymns by Theme, the word Love does not seem to feature anywhere !
    I was looking for ‘Father we Love You’.

    • Editor says:

      Hi Stuart – I understand your surprise. Searching by Theme refers to the section titles (themes) in the hymn book itself. If, however, you simply type “love” into the search box at the top of the page (right hand side), you can access a list of articles that include the word “love”, followed by the hymns with the word “love” in the title, including Father, we love you (StF 6). Just scroll down. I hope this helps.

    • stuart pedder says:

      Many thanks :-)

  28. Andrew Jacobs says:

    I purchased a copy of STF electronic edition on behalf of my church in July this year and was downloaded to my lap top and I use the programme as neccessary on behalf of the church.

    My lap top is now coming up for replacement as it is old and getting very slow, and I have been informed , to my surprise, that “Father Christmas” will be leaving a new lap top beneath my christmas tree!!

    How can I transfer the STF electronic edition to my new lap top when the time comes?

    • Editor says:

      Hi Andrew – For all electronic word edition problems, please check the help files on the hymnview website first. If questions or problems remain, please contact the product publishers direct at support@hymnview.com (And Happy Christmas when it comes!)

  29. Robert Drost says:

    Hi – when will the December calendar add / highlight the Sunday services with suggested hymns/readings.

    • Editor says:

      Hi Robert –

      thanks for your enquiry. Apologies that this is running a little late. We hope to have suggestions on the site for tomorrow (20th November)

  30. Asif Karam says:

    the Concerning person,
    I bought StF electronic Word edition, does this allow only one user or in church two are three people can use it to prepare services when local minister in preaching in other circuit church.? if answer is yes, then will you please remove Gillian Ross and add our church steward. James Smith.
    all given help will be much appreciated,
    Revd. Asif Karam
    Welling Methodist Church

  31. Taswin Karnadi says:

    How can I find the complete lyrics to STF 629: God of my faith, I offer you my doubt?
    Thank you.

  32. Bernard Luckcock says:

    I cannot find a place on the website which provides a detailed and reasoned explanation to changes in words of hymns/choruses.
    The lack of this puts me at a disadvantage when faced with worshipers who feel they have been robbed.
    yours faithfully,
    Bernard Luckcock

  33. Jo L says:

    I am are sure I have just missed the information but would much appreciate some help – may churches reproduce hymns from the ‘latest hymns’ section (with appropriate copyright information), as we could from the site preceding this one or is it necessary to contact each copyright holder individually for permission? Many thanks for your help.

    • Editor says:

      Hi Jo – new hymns are posted on Singing the Faith Plus with the understanding that they can be used freely, with any copyright information displayed apporpriately.

  34. Ken Holdsworth says:

    Could we please have hymns suggested for the second service as well as for the main service each Sunday? As a Worship Leader, taking non-preaching services without an accredited preacher, I now try to choose all my hymns from StF, and then print the words where they aren’t found in the hymnbooks that are available at a particular venue. In this Circuit of ten churches, including two operating on a very limited basis, we have services each Sunday in the two largest churches and have been having them for nine months of the year in a third church.

    • Editor says:

      Thanks for your enquiry Ken (and your subsequent note about the two services in each of your largest churches. This is a question we get asked occasionally, and also about the related lectionary readings. Just at the moment our resources are such that adding in further readings as well would be asking quite a lot more of our volunteer contributors. But we will continue to review this situation. We do appreciate that there are a variety of needs that we should try to address and we’ll attempt to do what we can as soon as we are able. Thanks for raising the point.

  35. Phil Collins says:

    This website is an excellent resource for those of us who have been used to searching an entire soft copy of hymn books for songs which include a particular word. It’s an excellent way to select suitable hymns for a service theme. Well done. Great that you are in touch with the latest technology.

    • Editor says:

      Thanks so much. There’s continually more to add and improve – but we keep working away on kt. Your encouragement is appreciated.

  36. R Newton says:

    Hi StF

    I tried to find hymns of the theme of prayer but couldn’t find a category?

    Surprised of Loughborough

    • Editor says:

      Hi, Surprised of Loughborough. An interesting point! Search themes on the site were initially based closely on those within the book itself. However, we have added some more over time and could add further… Soon available will be a prayer card that also addresses the idea of hymns-for/as-prayer. Thanks for your idea.

  37. Enid Clarke says:

    There’s much that I like about Singing the Faith …I enjoy a traditional hymn but also find some songs helpful and decidedly singable. No doubt some songs will not stand the test of time, but that’s true of any era. I cannot believe, however, that there was no place for Trust and Obey – poor decision, that one.
    My two main gripes, though:
    …When a tune is chorded and a capo is advised, someone had the bright idea of only displaying the ‘capo chords’ rather than both sets of chords. This means that guitarists and keyboard/piano players ie. me! have to waste their time working out the chords. I’ve scanned the feedback and couldn’t see this raised elsewhere – apologies if it has been.

    …Then there’s the digital download. Our church is fortunate enough to have a number of people who prepare material for projection in worship. This has resulted us in buying 3 licences so that they can all work on the hymn words in the comfort of their own homes. As if that wasn’t bad enough (at £30 a go), our computer – which had StF installed – has recently ‘died’ – leaving us without access to Singing the Faith. What’s to do? Buy YET ANOTHER licence? Not impressed.

    • Editor says:

      Hi Enid – thanks for your comments. The capo chords issue has indeed been raised a number of times but this was, as you rightly assume, a decision made early on in the publication process. I’m sorry that this causes you frustration. As to the electronic words edition, I suggest you direct your query about replacing your edition for the defunct computer directly to the publisher at support@hymnview.com

  38. David Griffiths says:

    Is StF also available for Kobo\?

  39. Martin Snith says:

    I am interested to know how the Singing The Faith+ site selects which Old Testament lesson to highlight. They seem to vary between the “related” and “continuous” reading for no discernible reason. For example June 16th to 30th are all “related”, July 7 to 28 are “related”.
    “Root On The Web” seem to consistently use the “related” reading. Is there are a reason for the different practices?

  40. Keith Bradshaw says:

    I think Singing The Faith is generally a superb publication and am constantly urging the remaining congregations in our circuit which have failed to buy copies, to do so.
    However, I was wondering if you are running a competition for the most glaring omission from STF. If so, I hereby nominate that magnificent Wesley classic: Hymns & Psalms 772 ‘Jesus, they wandering sheep behold’.
    When I came to choose hymns to go with John 10 11-18 a few weeks I was amazed to discover it hadn’t survived the transition from H&P. Of course, you will say ‘you could use H&P’, which is what we had to do, but it’s still a great shame!

    • Editor says:

      Thanks for your thoughts, Keith. I don’t think we’ll be running a “most glaring ommission” competition! However, of course we’re aware that there are many individual hymns that congregations still hold dear and find useful in worship. Their loss in StF was an inevitable consequence of the great number of newer hymns, often by contemporary authors and composers, that have been included. Many of these are proving very welcome. So, yes, it was a difficult balancing act. I’m sorry that you are disappointed about ths particualar ommission. Thanks for being in touch.

  41. Sue Levitt says:

    I love Singing the Faith Plus and the help it gives with suggestions for hymns each week. Thank you for this useful tool.

    However, I think there is a mistake in the lectionary passages for Trinity Sunday… the OT and Psalm seem ok but the NT and Gospel passages I think refer to the following week (9th in Ordinary time).

    Every Blessing
    Sue

    • Sue Levitt says:

      thank you! Sorry to have been a nuisance but thanks for the correction!

      Every Blessing to you

      Sue

    • Editor says:

      Many thanks for this Sue. Sorry about our slip-up and we’re glad to have resolved it for you (and many others!!) It’s always helpful when folk point our errors such as this – we are always happy to amend as appropriate.

  42. Norman Lester says:

    Can anyone give me any information about Allan Dickinson, author of the stunning “Where can we find you, Lord Jesus our Master?”

  43. David Fanshawe says:

    Now that you have been able to give a more detailed specification for the new proposed ‘Presentation Edition’ (same page size as the current heavyweight one, but thinner paper, like the Hymns & Psalms presentation edition) I have been able to calculate the weight. It comes to a staggering 1 kilogram! That is MUCH heavier than the Hymns & Psalms presentation edition (600 gm) – which was itself twice the weight of the ‘Methodist Hymn Book’ presentation edition I bought in 1966 (285 gm).

    My MHB (165 x 110 x 20 mm) had 1042 pages on fine ‘Indian’ paper containing 940 hymns (words and music) – many with alternative tunes – plus 32 additional tunes and 76 canticles and psalms – a far greater content than H&P or STF. But thanks to the skill of printers (Novello & Co,) it easily slipped into the jacket pocket of my suit. It is a sad indictment on the British printing industry that this skill has been lost over the past 50 years.

    • Editor says:

      Thank you for your comments, David. As you have noted, we don’t have an estimated weight yet; however, our understanding is that any presentation edition will come in at a lower weight than you fear. We hope that the final weight will be in the region of 65% lighter than the current full music edition.

      I think you do the printing trade something of an injustice when you worry about its loss of skills. Two factors are worth bearing in mind. Firstly, lightweight paper is increasingly difficult to source (and has been for many years), especially in the quantities that we would require – this is one of the reasons that we haven’t even been able to propose a presentation edition before now.

      Secondly, we have to remember that Singing the Faith is a much bigger book than Hymns & Psalms and The Methodist Hymn Book, not least because of the inclusion of contemporary worship songs that extend over a number of pages. StF is 1,794 pages in extent, compared to the Methodist Hymn Book’s 1,042.

      For both these reasons I’m afraid it was never very likely that we’d be producing a book as light and slim as the presentation edition of the 1933 MHB.

      • David Fanshawe says:

        The weight of the new edition will depend not only on the fine 28gsm of the paper, but also on the page size – which, in its turn, depends on the font used. The presentation edition of Hymns & Psalms uses an 8 pt font, similar to a broadsheet newspaper. The current StF music edition uses 10pt – easier to read, but needing a larger page size. It is a pity that the pages could not be shrunk down to the size of the H&P book. This would save a lot of expensive paper, and be more attractive to your customers.

        Incidentally, my compact 1960 edition of MHB used 6 pt text – tiny, but still perfectly readable (I am 70 years old). This allowed the printer to set over 1000 hymns and 1500 tunes (plus complete indexes) in just 1040 small pages. So perhaps I can still dream of a future StF pocket edition.

  44. Gillian Collins says:

    Glad to hear that a presentation edition may be made available. As a preacher I would always like to have my own music copy with me, but as I walk and use public transport I find it too heavy to carry around.
    But I will only buy the presentation edition if corrections to the first edition have been incorporated.

    • Editor says:

      Thanks, Gillian. I think you can take the incorporation of ammendments as read. They were all included in the recently produced organ edition, as I understand it. Basically, once the files are updated all further printings and editions work to the latest version.

  45. Joan Stott says:

    Dear Friends,
    I have been given “Singing the Faith” from a friend in England.
    I write for the internet providing weekly lectionary-based prayers entitled “The Timeless Psalms”.
    I am always grateful that the Australian hymn books have a list the details of hymns based on the Psalms as a great resource of type of paraphrase of the Psalms .
    I think that is something missing from your book, as I am now literally trawling through the hymn book hoping that the information is actually there with the words and music.
    Is such a list available but just not included in the book?
    Thanks
    Joan Stott, Australia

    • Editor says:

      Hi Joan – there is a Biblical Inex at the back of the music edition of Singing the Faith and, as you’d expect, references from the Psalms take up the most space. You can also find a link to the Biblical Index on the right hand side of every page on the website. All that said, it may be that there is inconsistency in when complete paraphrases are flagged up beside individual hymn texts. This is something we can look at on the website. Thanks for being touch.

  46. Gary Hargreaves says:

    I have found no other forum on which to express my opinion about singing the faith and though I may be in the minority I am so frustrated that I feel I need to share my views with someone.
    I find this hymn book deeply unhelpful and depressing for the following reasons.
    I have been hugely offended by yet more unhelpful changes to words in some of our richest hymnody,
    I have found significant numbers of the new hymns second rate, there are far better choices in songs of fellowship,
    I am frustrated that we see fit to encourage churches to spend money on changing to this hymn book when we surely have greater priorities facing us as a church.

    All in all I think this has to be the final death knell of the methodist church, because if we do not get out of this naval gazing that we seem so intent on pursuing we might as well shut the doors and all go elsewhere now.

    • Editor says:

      Hi Gary – I’m sorry you feel such frustration with StF; and you’re very welcome to express that frustration on Singing the Faith Plus.

      I haven’ t space here to give you a lengthy resposne to your comments, and I wasn’t involved in the decision-making around the hymn book itself. I think those who were, however, would say that the act of producing a new book was not intended as an act of naval gazing, and that the Church/Conference always tries to balance its activities appropriately – of which hymn book publishing is a relatively small (financially) but significant element.

      Hymns, as you clearly feel yourself, are such a deeply ingrained part of our Wesleyan/Methodist heritage that we wish them not to become museum pieces but living expressions of faith, to which new hymns are always being added. However one might feel about the quality/worthiness of individual new texts, the fact that many people continue to express faith in this way should be acknowledged, encouraged and somehow made available. There has been a good deal of positive feedabck about the content of StF and, while in no way wishing to diminsh the value of your own feedback, it’s worth noting that it has been balanced over the past year or so by those who feel they are finding new and accessible ways of expressing their faith, and that they are also re-discovering the richness of our long tradtion of hymnody.

      I realise that I haven’t responded to all your comments, but I do hope this is in some way helpful.

      • Gary Hargreaves says:

        Dear Editor
        Thank you for responding and including my comment. I am deeply grateful for the opportunity to have found an avenue to express my frustration.
        I do understand your point about the need to develop new music (I myself am a huge fan of both Matt Redman and Tim Hughes for example) but, for me, some of what has been included in SIF is frankly second rate and I believe History will ultimately show that .

        I suppose my biggest beef is the change of words that has come about in the almost zealous drive to Political Correctness. Hymns that have stood the test of time for nearly 1200 years in some cases are being sacrificed on this new altar we seem to have established. Case in point “Be thou my vision”
        Words should be
        Be Thou my Wisdom, and Thou my true Word; I ever with Thee and Thou with me, Lord; Thou my great Father, and I Thy true son,
        New words
        Be Thou my Wisdom, and Thou my true Word; I ever with Thee and Thou with me, Lord; Thou my great Father, they child let me be,
        Surely the allusion to sonship is our oneship with Christ?. The change is not only unnecessary it is poorly worded.
        Again the change to the words of Wesleys great him “Jesus the name high over all” ” Angels and Men” changed to “Angels revere” is just one example of how an unnecessary change has changed the meaning!
        I thought Hymns and Psalms was bad enough with changes like that in “To God be the Glory” where the “vilest offender” was changed to “every offender”, watering it down to virtually nothing, but the changes in STF are , again for me, destroying not enhancing our rich heritage of poetry and hymnody.
        I wonder if the next focus of the politically correct brigade will be holy scripture itself where all reference to Father and Son will be replaced by parent and child?

  47. PHILIP BALDWIN says:

    Has anyone else noticed this …

    O praise ye the Lord …loud organs his glory, sweet harp the story, etc is not in STF….

    but neither is it in H&P….

    or MHB !!!!!

    It seems so multi-faith that no-one surely, objects to the words

    and surely, most organists love to let rip with the final verse arrangement of Parrys Laudate Dominum!

    I have asked Rev Barbara Bircumshaw , Chair of the STF committee if she can shed some light on this .

    • Editor says:

      An interesting comment, Philip. Just to say, though, that Barbara is no longer charing the StF committee. The chair is the Revd Paul Wood. All the group members are listed on the site if you go to the Contact Us drop-down menu. http://www.singingthefaithplus.org.uk/?page_id=484

    • Paul McDowell says:

      Yes, that’s interesting. As far as I can see the only official Methodist hymn book ever to have included ‘O praise ye the Lord’ is the 1911 Methodist School Hymnal, which set it to Gauntlett’s Laudate Dominum rather than Parry’s. None of the three main pre-Methodist Union hymnals (Wesleyan, United or Primitive) had it either. Kevin Mayhew’s ‘Methodist Hymns Old and New’ does include it, but this is not a Methodist publication. I would have been very surprised to see it included in STF, as it’s an old hymn that’s never established itself in Methodism, and there are plenty of other hymns that reference Psalms 148/150. The last verse arrangement of the Parry can be found at STF 340.

  48. Andrew Letby says:

    Just to say thank you and recommend the new hymn recommended for Christmas:
    Heaven’s come so close tonight
    Hoping I might use it for epiphany too, can’t bear to wait until next year to sing it again!

  49. margaret robinson says:

    Trying to access the programme but unsuccessful “code 12″ comes up preventing access
    Also tried to do the update from hymnview.info/STF/download unsuccessful!

    This programme has not been used by our church yet but we will soon be requiring it, I’m not sure if its worth the money spent!!

  50. John Gosling says:

    I can find no means by which one may submit a new hymn for publication on this web site – presuming this is the proper place. Can you help, please?

    Thanks

    JBG

    • Editor says:

      Hi John – thanks for your enquiry. Simply use the email address on the “Contact Us” page of the site (you can find this on the yellow menu bar at the top of the page). I’ll see if I can make this information clearer on the Latest Hymns page also.

  51. MICHELLE CLEAL says:

    I am urgently looking for the descant part (organ) for Hark the Herald Angels Sing in same
    key as STF.

    Any ideas please.

    Many thanks

    Michelle

    • Editor says:

      Anyone have any ideas? The StF version of Hark the Herald is in the same key as in Hymns & Psalms and, to my knowledge, this was always a problem if the commonly used descant (published in Carols for Choirs) was to be used, as this is printed in another key.

    • David Roebuck says:

      I have never seen the “Carols for Choirs” descant in any other key – surely one simple way is to play all of the verses (or however many you need) from this collection?

  52. Sylvia Fuller says:

    Whilst I approve of most of the content I have no intention of buying a copy until a smaller, lighter music edition is produced. It was done for H & P (I am currently on my 5th copy owing to a variety of incidents) so why not for StF!!

    • Editor says:

      Sylvia – as you probably realise, you’re not the first person to raise this matter. It has been under discussion for some time but priority had to be given to publishing the organ edition (now done). Research on a possible “presentation edition” has been going on for a while and I plan to put some information on the site as soon as possible. Thanks for being in touch.

  53. Guy Turner says:

    I was delighted to see that if you search by my name, 4 of my 5 hymns in STF come up – however, the 5th, Come Wounded Healer, does not – it would be good if you could rectift – thanks

    Guy Turner

  54. Hugh McCredie says:

    It would be helpful to have the October hymn recommendations posted. I’m abroad quite a lot and need to prepare my services well in advance..

    • Editor says:

      Apologies Hugh – I’ve been slow putting the October suggestions up (not the fault of the contributor). They should be up this evening or tomorrow morning. (20th/21st)

  55. PHILIP BALDWIN says:

    Things seem to be slipping badly at best, falling apart at worse, at SfF plus.

    No updates for months on ‘give feedback’ or ‘other editions’ forums.

    I ordered 2 copies of the organ edition. We were told these would be distributed from the start of September. We are halfway through the month and no-one I have spoken to, has seen one yet !

    The CD tracks …more information would be available from the beginning of September ..well we are two weeks in , and where is it ?

    • Editor says:

      Hi Philip – thanks for your interest. You’re right to a degree. The summer has seen a slow-down of activity on StF+ (even the editor needs a holiday, I’m afraid), though work has been progressing in other areas and a refreshment of the site is in hand (see front page). To be fair, publication of the organ edition was scheduled for September, not “the start of September”. We’re keeping a close eye on how the printing is going and keeping in close contact with the publishers. Likewise with the CD tracks – work is progressing but the work is time-consuming and standards are high. So – we’re not falling apart, I’m pleased to say, but the editor is doing a little catching up and normal service will resumed very soon.

  56. Dave W says:

    When you list hymns please show the StF hymn number so that I can look up the words quickly.

    eg I want to see the hymns for harvest at http://www.singingthefaithplus.org.uk/?cat=75&search_type=and&order=title but you have to click on each one to see the number.

    • Editor says:

      Hi Dave – I take your point but the way that the site is set up, this would be a pretty sizeable task. However, I’ll raise this with others and we’ll have a think about your request. Thanks for your interest and for being in touch.

  57. Kip Bennett says:

    I suggest that you turn the comments, and notes and queries upside down so that the latset comments appear at the top of the page, not the bottom.

  58. Ted Bishop says:

    Planning well ahead for a service on 1st July I can’t open the resources by clicking on this date. Help!

    Ted Bishop

    • Editor says:

      Sorry, Ted! Help is on its way. Very soon.

      • Liz says:

        I am glad to hear that backing tracks are being recorded. Rather than a church buying 40 CDs would it not be possible to downlaod tracks as needed at a reasonable cost.

        • Editor says:

          Oddly, that would create copyright problems, whereas this method is watertight! (Sorry for the slow response – the Editor was on holiday.)

  59. Graham Pegg says:

    I find the hymn suggestions linked to the lectionary passages each Sunday really helpful. However the one weakness is that there is not a section dealing specifically with hymns suitable for children and All Age Worship. I know there is a full index in the music edition but a link to the Sunday lectionary themes would be really useful. Could a section also be displayed on the website?

    • Editor says:

      Hi Graham -

      I’m glad you are finding the Lectionary suggestions helpful in general. We can have a look at the questions of all-age suggestions. At the moment, of course, you can look up all the hymns categorised as for young people in the category seach on the right hand side of each page (under “Age Range). But this list does not tie directly to the lectionary (and wouldn’t tie to every Sunday in any case, I’m sure). However, the StF Reference Group meets soonand I will circulate your query before that.

  60. john green says:

    There does not seem to be any way of directly finding the metre of any particular hymn. I would need to know this before selecting an alternative tune. Thanks

    • Editor says:

      Hi John -

      the metre for every hymn is included on each hymn post. You can than use the Metrical Index (just below the search categories on the right hand side of each page) to find all other tunes with the same metre. Hope that helps.

  61. Mike Halliday says:

    “Search for Hymns by Categories” seems to have a serious malfunction. I selected Easter and Praise with all other items deselected: no hymns were found. So I tried every other Element of Worship with Easter and for each Singing the Faith has nothing to offer.

    From a modern selection of 790 Hymns and none has anything to relate the hymn, Easter and any element of worship! Quite unbelievable.

    However, thanks are due for the HaP to StF index.

    • Editor says:

      Hmmm… I see what you mean. This is not a malfunction as such; it is simply the way the search mechanism works. Because none of the Easter hymns have been categorised as Praise (they fall under other themes e.g. Jesus Risen and Ascended), they are not coming up for you. Simply typing in Easter is not a problem. We’ll take a look at this. (Glad the cross-reference index is helpful though!)

  62. Carolyn says:

    I was looking for the words or a rendering of the old Easter Carol that was sung at the folk session this evening – do you know of it?

    • Editor says:

      Hi Carolyn – could you give us a bit more detail? Was this a folk session on the radio – if so what station etc.?

  63. Gerald says:

    I visited this website expecting hymns with chords or at least the lead sheet. I was truly disappointed. Why do you have a collection of songs and hymns if one can only see the titles? Maybe I’m doing something wrong could someone kindly instruct me how to look at these hymns and songs?
    Warm regards
    Gerald

    • Editor says:

      Hi Gerald – we are working on the guitar chords question and expect to have more information on the site about this soon.

  64. Roger Collins says:

    The most frustrating thing about the electronic edition is that you cannt go directly into a power point

    the dilemna is to export to text and then paste each verse into powerpoint very time consuming or use hymn quest which is pretty good on converting to powerpoint but now require a proof reader to ensure the text is compatible.

  65. Meg Privett says:

    I despair at all the positive comments above. Very little of this seems to match my experience, namely:
    The electronic ‘key’ our church purchased is no use at all as I run an AppleMac and can’t use it. When we ordered it we had expected a disc would be made available so that A.N.Other within the fellowship would be able to use it. As it is, it’s just money wasted.
    I shall not be signing up for the organ copy – where on earth are small fellowships supposed to find £180? We will continue to make do with the giant pegs from Lakeland that we have always used with H & Ps. (Don’t have an organ copy for that, either)
    I read a comment above from someone trying to cope with a new hymn and thought that others struggling with new songs may be interested to discover that if you just ‘Google’ them quite often there are version you can listen to online that help with this.

  66. I join with ma ny others in welcoming StF and in bewilderment that there is no electronic (CD or DVD) version for projection. Like many other churches we project the words onto a screen. Y e s we could download the. Hymns and songs but our computer, I suspect like many others in churches, is not connected to the Internet. So this is a non-starter for us.

    However, it is good to find that there is some sense coming into MPH as we are to have organ/piano versions. Our organist will be able to do away with the elastic bands, binoculars and cancel the body building course!

    Come MPH, see sense. A CD of the words, please!

    Steve

  67. Donald Monk says:

    1. I also can see no point in an Organ Edition that has no improved layouts to overcome the page turning issues.

    2. Having downloaded the 8 landscape pages of corrections covering the errors in both the words and music versions, surely we should be given a sheet with peel-off stickers so we can make amendments in an elegant way rather than trying to mark up with ink or pencil – which would probably show through the flimsy pages an any case.

    • Editor says:

      An interesting idea, Donald – it will be taken on board, I’m sure. (Though, experience suggests that pencil alterations work neatly and don’t show through the pages.)

  68. Christine Wigley says:

    I am a roaming accompanist and have been asked to use the new book. Mostly this is not a problem but I came on hymn 241 and am not skilled enough to work out how ‘it goes’. Is there any way of hearing the tune as thepreacher did not know it and neither did the congregation
    Thanks

  69. Pauline Donaldson says:

    Can the Editor please confirm that the proposed organ-friendly edition of Singing the Faith will actually have the music in a larger typeface, as well as just having an increased page size?

    • Editor says:

      I certainly can, Pauline. The whole content of each page will be expanded, making the music and text larger and easier to read.

  70. Tom Williams says:

    Our organist is having big problems witgh the Music edition, as others are. We welcome the news that an Organ edition is being prepared, but if you want to maximise sales and make sure the print run is viable, why didn’t you email everyone who bought the Words edition online, instead of leaving your advertising to the Methodist Recorder article?

    • Editor says:

      Hi Tom – thanks for being in touch. The proposal for an organ edtion has been widely distributed – not simply via the press. We have contacted everyone who expressed an interest in an Organ Edition, as well as everyone on the Singing the Faith Plus News mailing list. You can find all the information – and how to register your response – on the front page of this website. I hope this helps.

  71. Stephen Pointer says:

    I can’t seem to access the hymn suggestions for April sundays – the calendar doesn’t seem linked – perhaps there are no more suggestions? ! Is this just a website issue or is that it?

    • Editor says:

      I’m so sorry Stephen – you’re quite right. The suggestions will be posted in the next couple of days – I’m sorry that we’re not further ahead on this. I am penitent, which at least I suppose is appopriate for the season of the year.

  72. Richard Dunn says:

    First of all, may I say what a marvellous collection of material we have in Singing the Faith. Generally the arrangements are musically ( in my opinion) much better than the previous book. There is a better awareness of correct harmonisations of the tunes, and the accompaniments are more correctly styled and musically imaginative. I am particularly pleased with the input of Paul Leddington Wright, who has a vast experience of modern church music. It is unfortunate therefore that there are several instances of difficulty in following the musical score,in the music edition.(for an example where the beginning of the song covers 2 pages, and the rest over the page,then a turn back required) As a performing musician, the organist/pianist/keyboard player needs a reliable score, without having to turn pages backwards and forwards! When the information came about the proposed Organists Edition, there are two real critisms. The first is the cost. 180 pounds seems an awful lot of money, and if there is to be NO change of Format, then it would seem to me to be a total waste of money. Come on publishers, get it Right!.

    • Editor says:

      Thanks for the positives, Richard, and also for the suggestions – these are certainly being noted.

    • Will Light says:

      I agree with the above comments. IT will be a total waste if the organ edition is simply the standard music edition blown up by 130% or so which is the figure I’m having to use on the photocopier to make any tunes not already in H&P or Songs of Fellowship Books 1-4 legible at the organ console. The biggest problem is those musical scores which cover 4 or even 6 pages and involve flapping around for every verse.
      Why cannot these hymns be printed on extra-wide format paper – 4 or 6 pages wide, folded zig-zag fashion and then bound into the rest so as to form a pull-out such as the Sunday colour magazines use for fancy car adverts. If we are expected to pay £180 plus for the organ edition this is the very least we organists should expect – to be able to play the tune right through using both hands and feet rather than being condemned to one-handed playing whilst the other flaps madly back and fore through the book.

  73. Geoff Havers says:

    I have only just (today) discovered this website as a result of an Email from Laurence Warering. I have played about with it a little to discover what it can do and have shown it to my wife who is a Local Preacher and it seems to me to be excellent. Keep up the good work of develpoping it.

  74. Annette Oxley says:

    I should probably qualify my earlier comment. I attend a small, rural chapel where we have no organist. I was very fortunate to receive a memory stick with over 600 H&S tunes played by a organist in my mum’s circuit in Manchester which means that not having an organist isn’t such a problem as it could have been. Having been given StF as a gift from a church member, I have very few of the new tunes electronically and it usually costs to get them downloaded so it could turn out to be quite expensive for me as I am the music provider!

    This raises a query – do you intend to provide backing tracks for StF at a reasonable price?

    Another totally separate query I have is that I have a lovely, leather-bound music copy of H&P which I received in 1994. It is still in very good condition and I wondered if you would be producing a leather-bound version of StF. (It would also be very useful to have that little strip of ribbon bookmark which is provided in the music versions of H&P.)

    • Editor says:

      Hi Annette – backing tracks are still being looked at as a matter of urgency. We will post news as soon as we have any. There has also been discussion about a “presentation edition” of Singing the Faith. At the moment the proposals for an Organ Edition are taking priority, but other edition options have not been forgotten. (And, yes, regarding your other post – you have a point: perhaps StF and H&P can be ssen as complementary – at least in the short term.)

  75. Annette Oxley says:

    Why do you need to dispose of H&P? Surely the two books are supposed to be used to compliment each other. Many well-loved and beautiful hymns have been omitted from Singing the Faith. I actually quite sad that people are thinking along these lines.

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